Galileo satellites issues with MNCORS

Not sure if there are any users in Minnesota on here that run off MNCORS. The MNCOR network has recently upgraded and now sends out corrections for Galileo satellites. When I turn them on my accuracy goes downhill. For an example I had two good shots on a section corner the other day and they were 15' apart. The LS struggles to get a good fix in areas where it never use to. If I shut Galileo satellites off I have no problems. Not sure if I have setting wrong or not.
 
I'm running six engines. I'm still learning the Javads. Not sure on what firmware but I have been keeping up on the recommended updates. Where can I what firmware I'm running?
 

Shawn Billings

Shawn Billings
5PLS
You may not be using Galileo at all. Look on the bottom of the engine screen. You will see GPS+GLO 6 Eng, GPS+GLO+GAL+BDU 6 Eng, or GPS+GLO+GAL+BDU 2 Eng. Currently, I think the two engine option is geared more for solutions using all four constellations. I would recommend looking at GPS+GLO+GAL+BDU 6 Eng. I think you'll get the most benefit from it, but feel free to try them out. You can customize the engines, so that they don't use Beidou, but there needs to be some variation in the engines otherwise they just produce the same answers and provide no independence. You'll know if you are actually using Galileo by looking at the engine screens. There should be a number below the European Union flag (blue with circle of stars).
 
Right now its set at GPS+GLO 6Eng. I have tried GPS+GLO+GAL+BDU 6Eng but was not making a difference. In the setup settings under GNSS I had to shut off the Gal satellites to get a decent fix. So the only satellites that are turn on are the GPS and GLONASS. I never had a problem like this until MNCORS did their update. I am in the office today and can try running GPS+GLO+GAL+BDU 6Eng next week with all the satellites turned on and see if that works any better.
 

Shawn Billings

Shawn Billings
5PLS
Also, make use of the Auto Setup Engines button. It will configure the engines for the best signals available at the moment. The only caveat is that currently it does not take into account the signals in the correction stream, only those tracked by the LS, so Beidou will be included. I'm not sure what might happen if you turn Beidou off on the LS and use the Auto Setup Engines button. In theory it should configure the engines based only on GPS, GLO and GAL at that point, but I have not tried it yet.
 
I have not tried Auto Setup Engines yet. Thank you for the information. I will do some testing next week and let you know if anything works.
 

Aaron S

Active Member
For what it's worth, I'm running Galileo on my LS off MNCORS, and had no troubles. Granted, I was in wide open skies at the time, but it seemed to work fine. More testing is needed for me also, but with the virus and whatnot my field time is regrettably reduced right now.

Also, double-check the mountpoint you're connecting to and make sure it's the one that says "GPS + GLO + GAL" or something like that in the description. You probably know that already but with the server change...
 

Aaron S

Active Member
I will double check the mount point but I'm sure I switched it. It's nice to know that there is someone else running the Javads in Northern Minnesota.

I was using mine up by Marcell today (I bet you know where that's at) and I was able to replicate your problem I think. I was in some young aspen stands (leaves all off of course) where there's a lot of multipath potential, but not a lot of blocked sky. I was running off a WiFi hotspot from the MNDOT VRS.

I started work with the default 6 engine / 4 constellation settings. It worked ok when I was using the precise topo preset, because that only requires 1 engine. When I went to shoot a boundary monument (using boundary preset) it would never initialize more than 1 engine no matter how long I waited, so I was dead in the water with that setting.

Without moving the rod, I switched to the 6 engine / 2 constellation setting (GPS + GLO only) and after resetting, it immediately had all 6 engines fixed and started "making popcorn" - that's what I like to call the epochs sound. So I don't think sky visibility was a factor.

I switched back and forth a few times to see what happens, and it had no problem when using GPS + GLO, but it seems when Beidou is in the mix, it can't get a lock. It was a little better when I used the 6 / 4 settings later this afternoon, so I don't know what's going on exactly, other than to say I think I'm having the same problem. I'm pretty sure the GPS + GLO + GAL can play nice together, so maybe there's a way to exclude all the Beidou satellites?
 

Shawn Billings

Shawn Billings
5PLS
I was using mine up by Marcell today (I bet you know where that's at) and I was able to replicate your problem I think. I was in some young aspen stands (leaves all off of course) where there's a lot of multipath potential, but not a lot of blocked sky. I was running off a WiFi hotspot from the MNDOT VRS.

I started work with the default 6 engine / 4 constellation settings. It worked ok when I was using the precise topo preset, because that only requires 1 engine. When I went to shoot a boundary monument (using boundary preset) it would never initialize more than 1 engine no matter how long I waited, so I was dead in the water with that setting.

Without moving the rod, I switched to the 6 engine / 2 constellation setting (GPS + GLO only) and after resetting, it immediately had all 6 engines fixed and started "making popcorn" - that's what I like to call the epochs sound. So I don't think sky visibility was a factor.

I switched back and forth a few times to see what happens, and it had no problem when using GPS + GLO, but it seems when Beidou is in the mix, it can't get a lock. It was a little better when I used the 6 / 4 settings later this afternoon, so I don't know what's going on exactly, other than to say I think I'm having the same problem. I'm pretty sure the GPS + GLO + GAL can play nice together, so maybe there's a way to exclude all the Beidou satellites?

Turn them off in advanced settings. Gear button on left side of action screen. GNSS.

From my phone in the field
 
Aaron yes it sounds like the same issue I have been having. I tried Shawn's idea of shutting off the Beidou satellites but I was is an fairly open Spruce/Tamarack swamp today so I didn't have much coverage (that's when it seems to struggle the most). I will continue to run with out the Beidou satellites and see if that makes any difference.
 

Aaron S

Active Member
Aaron yes it sounds like the same issue I have been having. I tried Shawn's idea of shutting off the Beidou satellites but I was is an fairly open Spruce/Tamarack swamp today so I didn't have much coverage (that's when it seems to struggle the most). I will continue to run with out the Beidou satellites and see if that makes any difference.

I'm probably talking out of turn here, but I wonder if it's an internet bandwidth issue? I never thought to consider this until just now, but the areas I was working in might have had borderline cell coverage (I didn't check at the time). Before, that connection had to only transmit data from two satellite constellations (GPS + GLO) - now it's four constellations, or double the data. Without knowing exactly how many MB of data is moving through the WiFi for RTK, could it be that our internet connections just can't transfer all that data quickly enough for the TLS to use it in computations/corrections? Just a theory, but maybe someone who knows this stuff better can chime in here.
 
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