Question about PPK results......

Darren Clemons

Well-Known Member
First of all, the addition of post-processing kinematic into the LS has been unbelievable valuable. There's not much the LS won't get great, validated RTK on, but on those it struggles PPK is there to back you up, or even better, to have another check on an already suspected good RTK shot.

My quandary though is this. Almost ALL the points I base/rover process come back saying the PPK solution is "fixed", even though sometimes two stored sessions on the same point do not match. I had two yesterday, both were 900 seconds and both came back fixed, but were about 1.0' horizontally apart. This actually may just be that I need to increase my time to 1200 seconds but I just wonder why if I wasn't on the point long enough, why didn't the solution come back float?

One of those two session I mention above, I had basically no RTK coordinate to compare. The group it stored was similar to 2,1,0 (I've lobbied and still wish we could just "reject" these types of RTK coordinates and only store the PPK data - a coordinate I know is wrong is only confusing to store).
The second session however, I had a group of something like 3,285,2 for RTK so I was confident that was good and one of the two PPK points verified that, within 0.05' - so in the end I had what I wanted, two different solutions that matched.

Again, this is a terrific feature but it does require a lot of careful sifting through the solutions to see/determine whether RTK or PPK (or both) are the correct solution. Of course, we the users are ultimately responsible for being confident that our data is correct and the LS gives us plenty of ways to do that.

I guess when all is said and done my question is; are there any "refinements" being worked on in the PPK process where, hopefully, we could get a better percentage of accurately tagged fixed/float solutions instead of almost all being labeled fixed?

What have any others who've used PPK extensively found? Is 15 minutes in heavy canopy reliable where you are? I'm probably getting 85% with what we've been processing and that's great. It's the other 15% where, as we've always talked about, you must have either a reliable RTK or a third PPK to get the two (or more) matching sets of data you need to feel the Javad 100% confidence.
 

Matt Johnson

Well-Known Member
5PLS
I guess when all is said and done my question is; are there any "refinements" being worked on in the PPK process where, hopefully, we could get a better percentage of accurately tagged fixed/float solutions instead of almost all being labeled fixed?

Alexey is always working on improving the Justin engine that is used for DPOS post-processing. The best thing that could be done is to record data from a 2nd base that would be used to check loop closures. Hopefully this will come soon.
 

Nate The Surveyor

Well-Known Member
The best thing that could be done is to record data from a 2nd base that would be used to check loop closures. Hopefully this will come soon.
Now, that has been on my mind.... Would it work well to use two bases, and 2 radios, (different freq of course) and then you could run a continuous closed loop.... Is that viable for RTK, or just for PPK?

Thanks!

N
 

Matt Johnson

Well-Known Member
5PLS
Now, that has been on my mind.... Would it work well to use two bases, and 2 radios, (different freq of course) and then you could run a continuous closed loop.... Is that viable for RTK, or just for PPK?

I was just referring to loop closure checks for post-processed Base-Rover vectors through DPOS but the GNSS firmware in Javad receivers already supports Multi-base but I'm not sure when the last time anyone has tried or tested this feature. More details about it are explained in GREIS Guide:

upload_2017-6-29_23-43-49.png
 

Nate The Surveyor

Well-Known Member
Wow, @Matt Johnson That took me deeper than I meant to go....
But, it LEADS to a question. WHY can we not simply USE 2 frequencies? Simultaneously?
Would that not be better? What am I missing, that makes me thing that's a beau coup of work, to keep it all on one channel?

N
 

Matt Johnson

Well-Known Member
5PLS
Wow, @Matt Johnson That took me deeper than I meant to go....
But, it LEADS to a question. WHY can we not simply USE 2 frequencies? Simultaneously?
Would that not be better? What am I missing, that makes me thing that's a beau coup of work, to keep it all on one channel?

N

The radio hardware is only capable of receiving data from one frequency at a time. This would require the rover to have a 2nd radio.
 

Matt Johnson

Well-Known Member
5PLS
I'm sure it could be done with hardware changes but it seems kinda unnecessary when a time division strategy could be used.
 

Nate The Surveyor

Well-Known Member
@Darren Clemons
As a reply to your op...
I started out with single freq. Post processed gps.
"Fixed" did not mean "100% correct" it meant that the gps thought it was correct.
However, idid have float solutions, that were 0.01' away from the real position, and, fixed solutions that were wrong by feet.
So, we never fully believed the answers, without other reasons to believe.
I had a point, near a chicken house, corner that was fixed, but, no amount of re-observation could get it to be correct, by closer than 0.87'. (it was a traverse point).
So, fixed to us never meant 100% true.
Having said that, it does make me think that it'd be nice to have a number of codes, that the software could use, to tell us it's opinion on quality....
And... Now I'm in over my head. Some one with more knowledge than I would have to carry this concept further...
 
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